Teewhy Posted September 24, 2017 Share Posted September 24, 2017 17 minutes ago, FlyJ said: Unfortunately, this is the sad thing about religion. Some argue it gives hope, but I honestly don't see that. I think it takes away the ability for people to think logically. People tend to suspend their senses when it comes to religious matters which I think is due to fear Couldn't agree more with your last statement there. Owning a church now is like getting rich quick scheme. MMM sef better pass am. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mimy Posted September 24, 2017 Share Posted September 24, 2017 6 hours ago, FlyJ said: Isn't religion modern day slavery? The existence of the average man is pretty bleak, he face lawlessness (unless you are rich, then you may get justice) grinding poverty, political unrest, lack of equality and financial uncertainity. If no faith in an afterlife then what does he have to aspire to. It's very difficult to avoid the conclusion that we simply invented the idea of an afterlife to ease the hardships of life and the inescapable pain of our own and our loved ones mortality. Religion has always been an effective tool for subjugation and keeping people in check. Feed people with beautiful stories of afterlife to give them hope and something to aspire to, so it'll prevent them from raising against oppression. Paint horrible picture of Hell to drive fear and scare them so they won't reject those beliefs hence easier to control. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teewhy Posted September 24, 2017 Share Posted September 24, 2017 2 hours ago, bluelion said: No,i don't think it is. Some religions, for instance Christianity (when unadulterated) is actually very liberating. How's it liberating? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dreamgal Posted September 24, 2017 Share Posted September 24, 2017 1 hour ago, FlyJ said: Unfortunately, this is the sad thing about religion. Some argue it gives hope, but I honestly don't see that. I think it takes away the ability for people to think logically. People tend to suspend their senses when it comes to religious matters which I think is due to fear. It does give hope, sometimes people need something to believe in. The idea of a God who will one day favour you and end your suffering gives hope to keep pushing. Also, there's a moral side to religion, it helps build good morals. A lot of kids don't want to commit sin for fear of hell, you can always threaten them with hell fire to make them do the right thing. It also encourages charity, generosity, helping your brethren. You are taught to give ,even though with expectations. Most importantly, it gives purpose. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scarlet Posted September 24, 2017 Share Posted September 24, 2017 1 hour ago, dreamgal said: It does give hope, sometimes people need something to believe in. The idea of a God who will one day favour you and end your suffering gives hope to keep pushing. Also, there's a moral side to religion, it helps build good morals. A lot of kids don't want to commit sin for fear of hell, you can always threaten them with hell fire to make them do the right thing. It also encourages charity, generosity, helping your brethren. You are taught to give ,even though with expectations. Most importantly, it gives purpose. Many persons ( mostly atheist) chose to turn a blind eye towards the positive sides of religion. Nicely written. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hipstar Posted September 25, 2017 Share Posted September 25, 2017 Do you ever want to run into your ex so you can pretend like oops almost didn't see you there cause you're insignificant now or I have other more important things to do than make small talk, bye gotta run? I just added it in my bucket list. Well I'm silly at times but I'm pretty so it's all balanced out 😌 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluelion Posted September 25, 2017 Share Posted September 25, 2017 17 hours ago, Gimbiyya said: The existence of the average man is pretty bleak, he face lawlessness (unless you are rich, then you may get justice) grinding poverty, political unrest, lack of equality and financial uncertainity. If no faith in an afterlife then what does he have to aspire to. It's very difficult to avoid the conclusion that we simply invented the idea of an afterlife to ease the hardships of life and the inescapable pain of our own and our loved ones mortality. Religion has always been an effective tool for subjugation and keeping people in check. Feed people with beautiful stories of afterlife to give them hope and something to aspire to, so it'll prevent them from raising against oppression. Paint horrible picture of Hell to drive fear and scare them so they won't reject those beliefs hence easier to control. I disagree with you on this dear. If anything, true religion actually makes existence purposeful. It makes you realize you ought to live this present life of yours in such a way that when you leave posterity remembers you for good. Talking about poverty, religion teaches you that the way out of it is to be diligent. "See a man diligent in his work,he will stand before kings and not mean men". About political unrest, true religion is clear on this "submit to governing authorities". Always do what is right and you will have nothing to fear. How do you know what is right? Simply ask yourself if what ever you do shows true love to your God and true love towards your neighbor. (This is actually the summary of the laws in Christianity). About inequality, It teaches you that godliness with contentment is great gain. You have to be content with where you are and what you are while on the journey to where and who you want to be. Does this in any way mean you should be a mediocre? No! That in itself doesn't show you have an excellent spirit in you. What it simply means is that you should realize you are a work in progress hence envy and jealousy for those above or who have it better than you should be nonexistent in you. About financial uncertainty, one thing is certain ' the righteous will never be forgotten and his seed will never beg for bread ' Religion let's you know that even when storms arise, you can never be stranded. Something will always come up. This will help you remove anxiety and the likes from your mind which in return will help prevent unnecessary health challenges. Also, you have a key with you that secures you financially and that is ' giving '. In whatever form it might take, once you are a giver, you can never lack. It will always come back to you pressed down, shaken together and flowing over. This makes you want to be a blessing to others and not just be blessed which in turn makes humanity better. So you see, eternity or afterlife as you prefer to call it, is like the butter icing on the cake and not the cake itself.( Or you can put it the other way round.) I also see it to be an hasty conclusion to say that the idea of an afterlife is to ease the hardships of life and the pain of our own and loved ones mortality. If you loose your beloved dog to death, do you live with missing it by believing there's an afterlife for it or do you mourn it and accept the fact that no mater what you do it's gone and gone forever? What exactly am I trying to say by this? It's simple, With or without religion, with or without the promise of afterlife people will still find a way of coping with their pain or worst worst kill themselves . So, the fact that religion helps comfort through pain doesn't mean it is invented basically for that purpose. That a house has a kitchen doesn't mean the house is the kitchen, or that houses are built for the sole purpose of having kitchens! About subjugation or keeping people in check, religion should be appreciated. Despite the numerous twisted versions of religion, it is obvious that it has helped reduce the crime rates in our nation. Imagine how wonderful Nigeria will be if religion is practiced in its true and pure self.. About oppression, it will only be allowed if people do not devote themselves to getting the right knowledge and will power to set themselves free. People should stop hiding their personal weakness,slothfulness and laziness under the guise of religion. I am not discriminating against anyone who follows a different path. What is true for you might not be true for me and I have no false sense of moral (or any other) superiority over anyone. All I am saying is that religion is wonderful and it gives a good life. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluelion Posted September 25, 2017 Share Posted September 25, 2017 16 hours ago, Teewhy said: How's it liberating? Dunno how to put it in words sef. Lemme just say, imagine having benevolent parents + a friendly counselor + an honest teacher + an IT guru + the commander -in-chief- of the armed forces + the best advocate + a loyal best friend + a caring lover all rolled into one beside you and having your back always! You can imagine how free you will feel right? Guess that's just a little bit of how liberating it can be dear Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mimy Posted September 25, 2017 Share Posted September 25, 2017 This argument that religion make men virtuous. Painting the idea that we should all be wicked if we didn't not hold on to religion. On the contrary It seems to me that the people who have held to religion have been for the most part extremely wicked. You find this curious fact, that the more intense has been the religion of any period and the more profound has been the dogmatic belief, the greater has been the cruelty and the worse has been the state of affairs. In the so-called ages of faith, when men really did believe religion in all its completeness, there was the Inquisition, with all its tortures; there were millions of unfortunate Scientists, women burned as witches; and there was every kind of cruelty practiced upon all sorts of people in the name of religion. Look around the world, you'll realize that every single bit of progress in humane feeling, every improvement in the criminal law, every step toward the diminution of war, every step toward better treatment of gay people, every moral progress that there has been in the world, has been consistently opposed by these organized religions. Ever wonder why it's safer to live in secular countries where there's separation of state and religion than those countries practising Theocracy. Morality comes from our evolution. Religion helped us codify it but made it static. Religion must evolve or it imprisons us in the past. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluelion Posted September 25, 2017 Share Posted September 25, 2017 I wonder how people have gotten religion especially christianity all mixed up. Well, I have to value the right of others to hold beliefs that I know absolutely, and without a doubt, to be wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teewhy Posted September 25, 2017 Share Posted September 25, 2017 I try as much as possible not to talk about religion, sometimes though. But I do as the spirit leads, most times. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dreamgal Posted September 25, 2017 Share Posted September 25, 2017 The stress atheist go through trying to disprove something that "don't exist" And Religion isn't just Christianity, there's a difference between being anti-christian or anti-islam and not just believing in any Creator. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scarlet Posted September 25, 2017 Share Posted September 25, 2017 @Gimbiyya I had decided to turn a blind eye to this argument until the "morality thing" came up. And I wish to correct the impression by quoting something Richard Dawkins openly stated relating to an "atheistic world" he said I quote "verbatim" "so, in a world without God, there can be "..no evil and no good, nothing but blind, pitiless indifference. Now God, = religion= morals. So the question is, Can one really be good without religion? Because if there was no religion, then what basis remains for objective of good or bad/ right and wrong. See, if there where no religion, there won't be an objective moral value, and here is why? Without some objective reference point, We'd have no way of saying something is up or down. Religion provides that point, for moral values such as Goodness, love, grace, truth and so on, and here is the standard where actions and decisions are measured. But if there was no religion there won't be an objective reference point, which means morality would be measured only subjectively. Atheist believe that since there is no God = religion, then there is no right and wrong( because heck that's what religion basically all about) hence subscribing to the "subjective kind" of morality, now with subjective morality, atheist mass murderers justified their wicked act against humanity. Mind you, that any wicked act can be. because morality is viewed from a personal perspective here , this has breed and brought about the most nefarious acts human kind had ever experienced. ( "Adolf Hitler" attempt to clear the "Jews" is the most prominent of them all) One of those other acts , are the juche ideology developed by north Koreans and has used it against people who believe in the existence of God, people who believed in God has been subjected to abhorrent torture and horrible deaths, according to media there are death camps scattered across north Korea where despicable acts are being committed against Christians. Not forgetting communist government hated people who believe in God, they also tortured, persecuted, and destroyed the lives of mostly Christians. And least i forget, the founder Marxism an "atheist" believes that before any revolution occurs there must be a bloodshed, ( you can read it up), I could go on about atrocities atheistic men committed because they were morally inept and was void of the what's good and bad. Extremism is detestable, reprehensible but I guess this is quite inherent in atheism. So I'm not surprised at all this brouhaha about religion. Y'all are to quick to pick on religion Con's, yet you forget the power of faith, and the humongous benevolence of the church, and how many have benefitted tremendously! Not forgetting the strength religion gave to many people. sighs Religion never codified morals, its actually the foundation where objectives moral values are built. without it, oh well. PS. I'm just passing by, engaging an atheist can be exhausting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators FlyJ Posted September 26, 2017 Administrators Share Posted September 26, 2017 4 hours ago, bluelion said: I wonder how people have gotten religion especially christianity all mixed up. Well, I have to value the right of others to hold beliefs that I know absolutely, and without a doubt, to be wrong. Does Christianity teach this too? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mimy Posted September 26, 2017 Share Posted September 26, 2017 *** hours ago, dreamgal said: The stress atheist go through trying to disprove something that "don't exist" And Religion isn't just Christianity, there's a difference between being anti-christian or anti-islam and not just believing in any Creator. It seems you're getting it wrong. If I made a claim that horses can fly. The burden of proof rest on me making the claim to support my claim with convincing evidence not the person who disbelief the claim. You don't need to disprove lack of belief. When I said I don't identify with any religion, I meant all forms. Be it the ancient ones practised by my ancestors before they were stripped off their beliefs/gods and replaced with the middle-eastern belief/gods. Honestly I don't really care if there is a God or not. Obviously he doesn't care either (that's if he exist). If he had wanted, he could have made his existence abundantly clear, testable, and provable. Not some spokespersons who paraded with absurd stories of what they think God want from us. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators FlyJ Posted September 26, 2017 Administrators Share Posted September 26, 2017 38 minutes ago, Gimbiyya said: It seems you're getting it wrong. If I made a claim that horses can fly. The burden of proof rest on me making the claim to support my claim with convincing evidence not the person who disbelief the claim. You don't need to disprove lack of belief. When I said I don't identify with any religion, I meant all forms. Be it the ancient ones practised by my ancestors before they were stripped off their beliefs/gods and replaced with the middle-eastern belief/gods. Honestly I don't really care if there is a God or not. Obviously he doesn't care either (that's if he exist). If he had wanted, he could have made his existence abundantly clear, testable, and provable. Not some spokespersons who paraded with absurd stories of what they think God want from us. My point exactly @Gimbiyya. It amazes me how people get drowned in this thing called "Christianity". Hoping for a God to come to their aid somehow. The unfortunate thing is this God never answers. A good example is the happenings in Nigeria. With all the prayers, intervention, Instagram praise, fasting, night vigil, offerings, and tithes, God has still not answered. Things are getting worse by the day in Nigeria. Not to mention the sick who pray and hope God heals them, still doesn't happen. Then you have the poor who give their all in worship hoping for a better tomorrow, still no answer. Sadly, this happens to be the trend with Christianity. The funny thing is the whites that brought religion/Christianity to Africa, do not practice it the way we do. Indeed the black man is in trouble! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mimy Posted September 26, 2017 Share Posted September 26, 2017 @scarlet Morality doesn't originate from religions, which explains why we all would be able to tell if religion asked us to do something immoral. The middle-eastern religions reenforces slavery, killing of apostates, gay people, blasphemers...We all can tell these are immoral because of our superior morality. Humans are social animals, as we evolved so do our sense of morality. I dont believe the reason why you think it's immoral to murder people, steal, rape...is because of the threat of hell fire or reward for heaven. We knew these things are wrong because we don't feel happy when same thing is to be done to us. The concept of morality is broad really. You should read on secular humanism. Those killings you claim were carried out by atheists. There are different between atrocities committed by bad people and those committed in the name of an ideology/beliefs/religion. The former dies with the people while the latter lingers. People committing atrocities in name of pleasing a god/belief will linger on as long as that belief continue to exist and young ones keep being indoctrinated into such belief. People will continue blowing themselves for Allah for heavenly rewards as long as the belief in Allah continue to exist. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mimy Posted September 26, 2017 Share Posted September 26, 2017 31 minutes ago, FlyJ said: The funny thing is the whites that brought religion/Christianity to Africa, do not practice it the way we do. Indeed the black man is in trouble! Our case is we black people are being more catholic than the Pope. We're simply lazy. It's easier to believe in god/prayers/miracles in solving our problems and blaming the devil for our irresponsibility. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teewhy Posted September 26, 2017 Share Posted September 26, 2017 5 hours ago, FlyJ said: My point exactly @Gimbiyya. It amazes me how people get drowned in this thing called "Christianity". Hoping for a God to come to their aid somehow. The unfortunate thing is this God never answers. A good example is the happenings in Nigeria. With all the prayers, intervention, Instagram praise, fasting, night vigil, offerings, and tithes, God has still not answered. Things are getting worse by the day in Nigeria. Not to mention the sick who pray and hope God heals them, still doesn't happen. Then you have the poor who give their all in worship hoping for a better tomorrow, still no answer. Sadly, this happens to be the trend with Christianity. The funny thing is the whites that brought religion/Christianity to Africa, do not practice it the way we do. Indeed the black man is in trouble! It is so unfortunate that people now serve God for bread and butter. And to worsen the case, those pastorpreneurs milk their members all in the name of Christianity and church going. Most church members are bench warmers, they only go there to give offerings and tithes and speak to their seeds in return for good life those pastors promise them. Those pastors, bishops, imams, and the rest are just there like figure heads. Even with the happenings and dangers in Nigeria, they still siphon money and other material things from their gullible members. I told someone, crime starts from the church and criminals are from the church. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Txunamy Posted December 8, 2017 Share Posted December 8, 2017 It costs nothing to be kind to people. We live in a cold world, and everyone can do with a little kindness and warmth.. Kindness is like a boomerang, it comes back to you.. This Christmas, be a rainbow in someone's cloud. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hawken Posted December 8, 2017 Share Posted December 8, 2017 On 09/25/2017 at 12:44 PM, bluelion said: I disagree with you on this dear. If anything, true religion actually makes existence purposeful. It makes you realize you ought to live this present life of yours in such a way that when you leave posterity remembers you for good. Talking about poverty, religion teaches you that the way out of it is to be diligent. "See a man diligent in his work,he will stand before kings and not mean men". About political unrest, true religion is clear on this "submit to governing authorities". Always do what is right and you will have nothing to fear. How do you know what is right? Simply ask yourself if what ever you do shows true love to your God and true love towards your neighbor. (This is actually the summary of the laws in Christianity). About inequality, It teaches you that godliness with contentment is great gain. You have to be content with where you are and what you are while on the journey to where and who you want to be. Does this in any way mean you should be a mediocre? No! That in itself doesn't show you have an excellent spirit in you. What it simply means is that you should realize you are a work in progress hence envy and jealousy for those above or who have it better than you should be nonexistent in you. About financial uncertainty, one thing is certain ' the righteous will never be forgotten and his seed will never beg for bread ' Religion let's you know that even when storms arise, you can never be stranded. Something will always come up. This will help you remove anxiety and the likes from your mind which in return will help prevent unnecessary health challenges. Also, you have a key with you that secures you financially and that is ' giving '. In whatever form it might take, once you are a giver, you can never lack. It will always come back to you pressed down, shaken together and flowing over. This makes you want to be a blessing to others and not just be blessed which in turn makes humanity better. So you see, eternity or afterlife as you prefer to call it, is like the butter icing on the cake and not the cake itself.( Or you can put it the other way round.) I also see it to be an hasty conclusion to say that the idea of an afterlife is to ease the hardships of life and the pain of our own and loved ones mortality. If you loose your beloved dog to death, do you live with missing it by believing there's an afterlife for it or do you mourn it and accept the fact that no mater what you do it's gone and gone forever? What exactly am I trying to say by this? It's simple, With or without religion, with or without the promise of afterlife people will still find a way of coping with their pain or worst worst kill themselves . So, the fact that religion helps comfort through pain doesn't mean it is invented basically for that purpose. That a house has a kitchen doesn't mean the house is the kitchen, or that houses are built for the sole purpose of having kitchens! About subjugation or keeping people in check, religion should be appreciated. Despite the numerous twisted versions of religion, it is obvious that it has helped reduce the crime rates in our nation. Imagine how wonderful Nigeria will be if religion is practiced in its true and pure self.. About oppression, it will only be allowed if people do not devote themselves to getting the right knowledge and will power to set themselves free. People should stop hiding their personal weakness,slothfulness and laziness under the guise of religion. I am not discriminating against anyone who follows a different path. What is true for you might not be true for me and I have no false sense of moral (or any other) superiority over anyone. All I am saying is that religion is wonderful and it gives a good life. If I wasn't already dating and in love.... 😢i love you @bluelion 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MENA Posted December 14, 2017 Share Posted December 14, 2017 On Thursday, June 29, 2017 at 7:10 AM, kimi said: Lagos traffic is a bastard. You will not destroy my sex life. The fatigue is unbelievable Never knew traffic could destroy sex life. Hmmm.... Interesting Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators kimi Posted December 14, 2017 Author Moderators Share Posted December 14, 2017 2 minutes ago, MENA said: Never knew traffic could destroy sex life. Hmmm.... Interesting Hahahaha. Me being overly dramatic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MENA Posted December 14, 2017 Share Posted December 14, 2017 1 minute ago, kimi said: Hahahaha. Me being overly dramatic I understand but l guess you where in for it that day Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators FlyJ Posted January 19, 2018 Administrators Share Posted January 19, 2018 Compliments on the fro tho. #shy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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